It's about YOU

[jaceinla]

Wasn't planning on writing any of this, but after reading a post about looking lustfully at women and using a rubber band to snap your arm when you looking went too far. What are we? Animals?

There was a great thread that changed my outlook on this addiction back on NP Supports Boards that was titled "The No Challenge Challenge".

The idea was that everyone gets this false idea in their head that if they make a day count or stop looking at women they will be cured. Well guess what, it doesn't work that way. You don't recover from an addiction by halting. That's just a really strong discipline you have.

You've gotta look at yourself in the mirror and ask the biggest question of your life.

WHY? Why am I here? Why do I have this addiction?

Is it depression? Is it guilt? Is it fear of rejection? Is it loneliness?

Throw that rubberband snapping technique out the window and start snapping your brain. Change your LIFE around deep inside yourself. Don't JUST day count and avoid looking at women. It doesn't happen over night.

If you slip, don't freak out, don't feel down, learn...WHY did I slip? Where was my mind? Why was it in that state? Why did I feel that way?

You keep doing that and you'll slowly peel back the layers that are your life and learn more about that person deep within you. The REAL you. And once you make those changes, you'll be way too happy with life, loving every second of it, to even consider looking at P again. That's recovery in my book.

[RobP413]

I agree with the sentiment of your post, but perhaps to play devil's advocate here... I would not tell anyone, as long as they are staying sober and meeting their goals, that they are not recovering the "right way", or using the "right techniques".

I think to most people, day counting and laying down hard-and-fast rules, making PHYSICAL reminders (like the rubber band technique), are helpful for folks. Especially when you're just starting out.

Recovery, IMO, is overwhelming. And I think at the outset, it is too much to ask most people to "just think about WHY you are a PA". For many, especially starting out, all they're trying to do, 24/7, is avoid P. Any way they can. And it's a constant struggle because P is a jealous mistress that doesn't let you away without a fight. Anything that helps in the fight against that B%$#@, I'm all for it.

IMO.. For everyone, it is different. I think counting days and making physical reminders for yourself to stay between the lines are helpful to most. I would not fault anyone using these techniques because I think many will come here and tell you that they have been helpful.

So I will say, 1) I agree, it is important to know WHY you got to where you are, and why you are a PA, but 2) I would not discredit any technique that is being utilized by someone in recovery. Day counting, for example, will not work for everyone, but some people find great benefit from it.

The main point is that a PA in recovery has 1 goal: Avoid P. I don't care how you do it. And any way you manage to reach that goal is the RIGHT way for you.

[Zachary]

There was a great thread that changed my outlook on this addiction back on NP Supports Boards that was titled "The No Challenge Challenge".

The idea was that everyone gets this false idea in their head that if they make a day count or stop looking at women they will be cured. Well guess what, it doesn't work that way. You don't recover from an addiction by halting. That's just a really strong discipline you have.

Addictions have root causes. Addictive substances are addictive in and of themselves (no doi) but why is it that some become addicts and some don't? Root causes. You have to dig deeply into yourself, into your past and ask the tough questions. Why did I get addicted? What drove me to this addiction in the first place? How did I ever convince myself this was right or okay? More often than not, I haven't liked the answers I've found, and sometimes they've led to bigger problems. But they've been informative. And knowledge, as they say is power. Mere abstinence can be the first step in a recovery, but without digging deeper, you'll always be just abstaining and not really recovering.

[blindside]

Thank you so much for this post. It's exactly what I needed. Just a couple of days back I ended a 28 day streak of abstaining from my addiction. What you've said here is exactly what I've gone over in my head. It's been very hard not to let myself spiral down in despair by focusing only on the physical failure of having held out as long as I planned. The only thing I keep telling myself is that in the long run this isn't about self denial alone. It's about unearthing the root causes behind the addiction

This last time when I acted out I could see in complete detail the depression in my life that caused it. It may seem like 2 steps forward with 1 back but it's progress.

Thanks again for your post.

[jaceinla]

Rob I can understand your post, but to counter it, lets look at both outlooks towards "Looking away from women when you see them"

Alright, you have two options:

1. Slap yourself with a rubber band, feel good because you slapped yourself and move on.

2. Slap yourself with a rubber band and ask WHY. Why am I interested in looking at that person? Am I focused? No? Why not? What can I learn from this?

Option 1 you don't learn anything except that you can slap yourself and respond. That's wonderful but it will get you no where.

Option 2 you focus on your recovery. Your learn more about your mindsets. You learn more about who you are. You slowly start peeling away the person you used to be and SLOWLY start transforming into a person you WANT to be.

Is this making sense? Simple day counting and slapping is like building a house on a broken foundation. When the REAL pressure comes, and you haven't learned anything new, whats going to happen?

[Yechezkel]

P and Mb addiction is in the brain, it's all about chemicals.

Chemicals are released when we Mb and or use P, and thats what our bodies crave, I don't think we can just abstain on sheer willpower and in the beginning at least for me, it helps to distract myself, weather I snap my wrist with a rubber band, or I talk to someone if anyone is around to talk to,

I just can't do it on sheer willpower, and for me the 100 days goal thread helps, it makes me feel a sense of accomplishment when I do well, I need that. Maybe some people don't but I do.

I can't see the forest through the trees, meaning I had to get recovered a little before I could work on me, the real reasons I looked at P and Mb'd.

I think eventually we all need to look deeper and find the WHY behind our addiction, it may be a bunch of why's all piled together, but first things first, at least for me, I needed to stop for a while before I could go deeper into the reasons behind it all, everyone grows at their own rate.

I might grow slower than others but I do the best I can, and for me distraction, even painful distraction like a rubberband helps to SNAP me out of the P and MB mindset, (pardon the pun)

Just speaking for me here....

Yechezkel.

[Phil413]

I hate to disagree with you, Jace, but I'm going to anyway. :)

You're right that it's good to understand why we act the way we do, and to formulate alternate, healthy ways of meeting our perceived needs.

But . . .

When we give in to lust it isn't because we haven't thought it through carefully or logically enough. Lust is all about feelings, both physical and emotional. This addiction operates at a level much deeper than logic and reason, and it really doesn't respond to argumentation and learning.

That's why the rubber-band snap can be a useful tool (I guess -- I've never tried it). It works at a level deeper than rational thought. It works on the level of physical feelings, which is the same level that lustful urges are operating on. It's an attempt to reprogram the brain to associate lust with something physically unpleasant, rather than something physically pleasant.

It's not a magic bullet, of course, but it seems to me that it could be a useful weapon in the arsenal.

Phil

[rosie]

@-) Way to come in with a bang!

I agree with what you're saying (in some respects), I see what you're saying, I see anger in your post (hello kin!). But I feel like asking you - who died and made you Queen Sexpert? (i jest..sort of).

I think the rubber band technique sounds like a good FIRST step to stopping the inappropriate behaviour - anything that diverts is a good first step, IMO. But I don't think that's recovery.

I feel for men in a way - they are pretty much conditioned from birth to sexualize women. As much as I hate facing this reality - I believe that they are in some sense victims of our hyper sexualized society and this is a big deal for them. Our society even encourages sensualization/objectification as a "manly" thing to do - and so, these men who are here trying to change years and years of conditioning are having to work really hard. If a rubber band helps them on the start of recovery, who are we to condemn them?

And I hate to break it to you, but we are, in fact.. animals. :P