New here and ..What is classified as addiction ?

[maggie]

Hello TTF Members !

I have been searching websites about the massive infiltration and psychological impact of porn on youth, males, marriages, and life in general for about 2 weeks.

This site stops the philosophical discussions and gets right to the person or person(s) involved with porn... in some way.

Is it an addiction or just curiosity, is it natural or is it harmful..or is it just a new form of entertainment for computer addicts. I've read so many conflicting opinions. I just know the intrusion of porn into my family has caused major problems.

It is such a private activity, no one else really knows what the person is doing. So, how can the SO know if it what the person is doing is an addiction ? I can't measure the hours or the time.

I don't know how often or how much or how important porn was in his life. After reading many posts on TTF and other sites, I can easilly blame it for many of the negative changes in his behavior over the past few years. The coldness, the disconnect and the avoidance of being together.. But I just don't know.

He strongly denies an addiction or any further need to view it, now that it has been discovered. He claims that most of it is weird and sometimes gross !

So, I asked " then why look at it ? " He defends his viewing by saying that it has been sent to him by email for the past three years and he has never solicited it on his own. But he still looked at it and did whatever he did, for 3 years.

I cannot figure this out. Been happilly married for over 20 years.

[givingupforgood]

Hi maggieliz,

I'm pretty new here myself and not an expert at all, but I thought I'd offer some thoughts... It seems to me that the only person who can really know whether or not it's an addiction is the person who's actually using it. I realised that my use of P had become addictive when I stopped being able to control it. From the outside, I guess it must be really hard to tell whether or not someone is in control or whether it's controlling them.

But it seems to me that if, as you say, 'the intrusion of porn into my family has caused major problems' then it's something you have to deal with. Whether or not it's an addiction in the strict sense of the term. It seems you have talked to your husband (I presume?) but I think the most important thing - if you haven't done this already - is to make him aware of the changes in his behaviour that you've noticed, and how they make you feel (rather than accusing him, which will only make him defensive). Then I suppose it's up to him to look inside himself and think about why he's changed, and whether it is to do with P.

I hope this doesn't sound patronising?! And I hope it's in some way useful. Like I said, I'm new to this site myself so this post is just thoughts off the top of my head, hopefully some more senior members will also contribute!

Anyway, good luck...

[Crisodian]

Maggie,
First, welcome to TTF. I am a SO of a PA.

Is it an addiction or just curiosity, is it natural or is it harmful..or is it just a new form of entertainment for computer addicts. I've read so many conflicting opinions. I just know the intrusion of porn into my family has caused major problems.

The question of P addiction and what it means to each person affected by it, addict or SO, is a tricky and personal thing.

First, I believe it is a true addiction. Some other sites I have been to question whether PA is real. I firmly believe it is as real as drug addiction or alcoholism. I've seen the affects of it on my own family and my own husband.

So, how can the SO know if it what the person is doing is an addiction ?

IMO, I think P addiction becomes problematic and a true "addiction" when the fantasy of P becomes reality, when one can't control the urges and desire to view P, or requires P to achieve s*xual release and satisfaction. Trading the real "thing", real intimacy, for P, becomes more than just entertainment.

There's a good thread here on signs of P addiction in the Partner's Forum.

I just know the intrusion of porn into my family has caused major problems.

To me, and again, this is just my opinion, if you as the SO are seeing major changes in your husband's behaviour and you do not condone or accept P use, then it is a problem. Addiction or not, it should be discussed between the two of you, honestly and openly.

Trust your gut. If you think something is wrong and you attribute it to your husband's P use, confront it now before it escalates.

So, I asked " then why look at it ? " He defends his viewing by saying that it has been sent to him by email for the past three years and he has never solicited it on his own. But he still looked at it and did whatever he did, for 3 years.

The challenging part of PA is that it starts small, and grows to a monster in a short amount of time. The chemicals in the brain that cause the "rush" of pleasure demand more and more and more over time, skewing the body's natural chemistry to where the P/MB become a "need" to achieve that rush. (Similar to a drug addict needing more and more to achieve a "high".) There's a great article here and a thread related to it as well.

I hope this information helps.

Again, welcome to TTF. :)
~C~

[maggie]

Thank you for your time and response.

I haven't been able to talk to anyone about this, because it is embarassing and don't want people to consider my H a 'pervert' I've been looking for a knowledgable counselor.

I appreciate your understanding of the fact that " from the outside it is difficult to tell if a person is in control or being controlled by P " That really is one of my major concerns, because he claims he has stopped and it is over for good. That's a pretty lofty statement for a person who was involved in something so secretive.

He says he is embarassed by what he did and that he " got lost "

I do have some sympathy for men who get lost in P, because it seems that the P industry in general and some women in particular, know precisely how to manipulate and control men and pull them into it. In that way, it is like an irresistable enticement, that conquers its victims, but in a pleasing way and deceitful way.

[maggie]

Dear Crisodian,

As the very first SO ( harmed partner ) I have communicated with, I have to ask you this question.

Did you go back & forth between total rage and disgust toward your husband.... to a profound sense of pity and understanding and seeing men as victims of this gigantic P industry that ruins lives through total manipulation of their thoughts and emotions ?

Prior to this problem, I was a total advocate for men and felt as though females held all the power over men, in many ways. Not just in divorce settlements and custody issues, work preference/ employment security, but even in social/family ways of deciding which family members or friends would be included in gatherings and involved in their lives. Women seemed to be in charge of all the social decisions, which is big part of life. Now, I am questioning everything I have ever believed about the fm v m power struggle.

[Crisodian]

I haven't been able to talk to anyone about this, because it is embarassing and don't want people to consider my H a 'pervert' I've been looking for a knowledgable counselor.

No one here, at least none that I have come across yet, classify any PA as a pervert, which is very nice. Llike you, I do not want my H to feel that way either. It is personal and embarassing for many. That's what, IMO, makes TTF different. This whole site is all people either affected by or addicted to P. It makes it very comforting to be able to share with no labels.

On the counselor front, I would suggest finding one, if you can, that deals in addiction. Some of the general counselors don't feel equiped to deal with PA. My H ran across that in his search.

I do have some sympathy for men who get lost in P, because it seems that the P industry in general and some women in particular, know precisely how to manipulate and control men and pull them into it. In that way, it is like an irresistable enticement, that conquers its victims, but in a pleasing way and deceitful way.

So many keep pushing money into the industry and making a fortune. It's no wonder it continues its viscious cycle. ~X(

Find a path to peace,
~C~

[Crisodian]

Dear Crisodian,

As the very first SO ( harmed partner ) I have communicated with, I have to ask you this question.

Did you go back & forth between total rage and disgust toward your husband.... to a profound sense of pity and understanding and seeing men as victims of this gigantic P industry that ruins lives through total manipulation of their thoughts and emotions ?

For the first few weeks, yes I did. I keep an offline journal of my emotional turmoil. A place where I can rant and rave and just get the emotions down on paper. When a cooler head previals, I can go back and comment for myself on my emotional state.

I accepted his P use as an addiction from the start. That's a challenge for some SOs. I guess I also have a different perspective (than some SOs here on TTF) because, being a recovering non-P addict, I understand addiction. I understand what addictive behaviour is and some of the contributing factors which lead up to his addiction. Like you, I also started educating myself like crazy about PA.

Do I condone it? Absolutely not.

Having been in recovery from addiction for a long time, I knew what my H was about to battle - both personally for himself and facing all the P and semi-P "stuff" that is almost everywhere these days. On the other side, I also had to deal with the "discovery" of his PA and my own emotions, this time as an SO.

Prior to this problem, I was a total advocate for men and felt as though females held all the power over men, in many ways. Not just in divorce settlements and custody issues, work preference/ employment security, but even in social/family ways of deciding which family members or friends would be included in gatherings and involved in their lives. Women seemed to be in charge of all the social decisions, which is big part of life. Now, I am questioning everything I have ever believed about the fm v m power struggle.

To be honest, I have worked in male dominated industries for a long time and fought my way to where I am today with my current employer. Fought hard to prove as a woman I am capeable enough, smart enough, and tough enough to "hang with the men", so to speak. So I will have to think on the thoughts you have shared before I share my opinion.

I do acknowledge that in social decisions women do seem to wield a lot of power. Hmm... you have me thinking. Thank you.

~C~

[artguy34]

Hello Maggie, welcome to TTF,

I hope you find some answers you are searching for? I am a PA and I am Crisodians husband. While reading your posts, I came across this paragraph and I do have some concerns...

I appreciate your understanding of the fact that " from the outside it is difficult to tell if a person is in control or being controlled by P " That really is one of my major concerns, because he claims he has stopped and it is over for good. That's a pretty lofty statement for a person who was involved in something so secretive.

He says he is embarassed by what he did and that he " got lost "

I can say the same thing a little over two years ago when my wife confronted me about my P use. I promised her I would quit and give it all up. (In my mind and in my heart I truly believed it too) But the problem was, I am an addict. Even though I stayed away for a long time. I was not only addicted to P, but MB as well. It was my MB addiction that led me right back into the use of P.

This time when my wife confronted me, she made THE final ultimatum and told me I had to come clean. I was scared out of my mind because I didnt know how to open up and I was scared about her viewing me as a pervert, finding me disgusting and revolting. I had always hid my use of P from everyone. It is a natural instinct to hide it because it is "socially forbidden" yet when discussed among guys, they view it as "no big deal". An unspoken guilty pleasure.

Well this time in order to truly back my words up, I had to think long and hard about my use and how it consumed me. When I figured it out, that's when I admitted to her that I do have a problem and that I do need help.

Without writing forever, all I will say is that in order to "prove" my promise to my wife, I had to let my actions speak for themselves. One of the many ways is to be open and honest with her. Let her control the usage of the computer, block cable channels so she can have some peace of mind. I have to build back the trust I destroyed by lying and being deceitful to her.

I fear that if your husband truly doesnt do some soul searching in himself, he may go back to viewing P even though he may truly wish to not view P again. Once addicted, there is no true way of just walking away from it. Many things can "trigger" him into viewing P again. Even if he wants to be true to you, it is hard to resist unless you understand the magnitude of what P can do to someone and have a plan to fight those triggers.

One way to prove his actions is to allow you to put filters and blocks on your pc to prevent him from viewing P in the future. As long as he is open to your involvement and does not get defensive, he may be on the correct path. But trust your gut instinct, it is usually correct!

Another way is to have open conversations where you both can share your thoughts in a peaceful controlled manner without fear of the other getting mad or angry. Because as I can see, you need to let him know your feelings of hurt and betrayal as well. This is a healing process for both of you, not just him!

Good Luck on your journey!

[gnein]

Hello TTF Members !

I have been searching websites about the massive infiltration and psychological impact of porn on youth, males, marriages, and life in general for about 2 weeks.

This site stops the philosophical discussions and gets right to the person or person(s) involved with porn... in some way.

Is it an addiction or just curiosity, is it natural or is it harmful..or is it just a new form of entertainment for computer addicts. I've read so many conflicting opinions. I just know the intrusion of porn into my family has caused major problems.

I think a lot of young men, or even teenage boys are naturally curious about P and sx, but it becomes a problem or an addiciton when a person loses the power to stop. In the past I've put myself in some dangerous situations because of P, I've missed out on relationships because of P. I've also neglected friendships and put off other activities that would have been more fulfilling because I spent the time looking at P instead.

Now I'm the sort of person who would normally choose spending time with friends over not spending time with friends, or choose pursuing enjoyable and healthy activities over not pursuing enjoyable or healthy activities, and I passed the age where I was "curious" about P long ago. Really, the only thing that keeps me coming back is the urge I feel as though I "have" to satisfy, which ultimately leads me toward making decisions that I wouldn't normally make.

It's also worth noting that P affects different people in different ways, just like any other addiction. For example, my best friend from school was able to quit P with minimal effort, but other men (such as myself) struggle with it for years -- even when we're fully aware of the damage it's doing to us and the people around us.

The point you raise about "entertainment for computer addicts" is an interesting one. I probably spend more time online than I should, and I've often wondered whether I have an addiction to that as well, and whether it could be feeding my PA issues. Perhaps that "entertainment for computer addicts" may be more dangerous than it sounds.

[maggie]

Thank you for replying. I am shocked at what I've been learning about the impact of porn in people's lives and I do think our obsession with computers/online is amplifying the growth of porn viewing. It is available 24 hrs in your own home!

How many young males view porn out of innocent curiosity and just as their hormones are surging, the psychological process of ' desensitization ' kicks in and they begin to look at and accept images that are bizarre and ridiculous.

I'm learning how porn, a rehersed and unrealistic marketing ploy, can become important enough in a person's life that it replaces the meaningful experiences in life.

I guess I understand how easilly a young male could be pulled into this addiction, but what is happening when a 50 year old, married man is pulled into porn?
Does it ever become just an issue of one's character or self-control ?