It's Here..There.. Everywhere... So Deal with it.

[maggie]

After D day, I cancelled our cable channels.

I struggle to understand story lines as I quickly flick through channels whenever there is a risque scene... ( every 5 minutes )..... I avoid all R movies, even when they have meaningful themes and life lessons, and I fast forward through PG 13 movies.... all to avoid Triggers.

Tonight I became a rebel !!!
Having managed my own ballet studio for years... I enjoy " Dancing with the Stars "

Presentation is important, but I don't really appreciate the skimpy outfits, wigs, red lipstick and make-up in order to perform a dance.... but watching the rehearsed, disciplined and physically challenging routines is amazing.

I've been trying to sneak in an episode here and there when he is busy; quickly flicking the controller when I hear his footsteps gettting closer !!! What ? Why am I being punished ?
Am I looking at something horrid ? It's a dance contest.

Tonight I watched the complete hour of the semi finals of Dancing with the Stars... and did not change channels whenever I heard his footsteps nearing the room.

I simply stated to him, " I know these outfits and makeup may be a trigger for you, and I admit they have been a trigger for me too ( anger ).... but I am not going to restrict my life and limit the things I enjoy any longer, because you or somebody else can twist what it is...... into something it is not..... It is professional dance routine. It is a challenging and difficult skill.

It is not an invitation to isolate oneself with selfish thoughts.

[FoolishMind]

I hear your Maggie, It must be really tough for you. I can also very much relate and compliment your post from the other side. I also really appreciate dance programmes and particularly like Dancing on Ice, but I will openly say sometimes the outfits that are worn, leave very little to the imagination, a PA's imagination is not a good one to have.

In my first 1 probably if 2 years, I did not watch anything where too much flesh was shown, even if it was not sxually related. e.g. I love Tennis, but stopped watching female tennis. Sad or what. In the same way, my wife had to change the programs she watched, but we changed massiveley because it was worth the deprogramming of my brain, and the saviour of our marriage.

Fast Forward 3.5yrs we are open to watching a lot more now, without the itchy trigger finger on the remote. My wife stopped watching a few programmes because of me, and I felt bad for this, and I was very straight, this is my problem not hers, and I always made sure I was in another room playing a computer game or something, to allow her to have her time without restriction. Your H will and should understand, and trust me its so worth it. I love the place im in right now, and its only because I was ruthless and OTT about the rules I set in place initially.

FM

[IN NEED OF HELP]

I love this post.
This may be what all the household are like, when an Addict lives in one. there are so many shows, that my SO loves to watch, but because of me, she tries not to watch them. I feel bad about this, because, she should not be denied in watching something, that she enjoys watching. My SO is never one, that watches things anyway, when there is nude scenes in them.

What I do know, if she is watching a program, and something comes on, that I know she is going to change it, because I am in the room, I will get up, go to the kitchen, and get us a snack or something. I will stay in there until I know that this scene is over with, and I know it is ok for me to go back in the front room, to enjoy the movie with her.

We also, are big fans of dancing with the stars, and I do sit there and watch this with my SO. I just try to look at this show, and not allow any thoughts to come to my mind, and I am able to do this. but, to be honest, my SO does know how I feel about one professional dancer, and when she is dancing, I do here, some remarks from my SO. so when this dancer does come on, I find myself in the kitchen again, doing things, so my SO can feel a little more at ease during this dance. but now that she is off the show, I can set there without needing to get up

It is a sad thing, that because we are addicts, that our SO can not enjoy life the way they use to. this addiction, has taken away so much from our SO"s, and it just is not fair to them, that it did.

So no matter what it is, that we are watching, I will get up and leave the room, if something comes on, if it is going to interfere with my SO watching her program

And besides, it is a lot healthier for us addicts, if we don't see this crap, even if it is just a one minute scene

[RichBlack]

Maggie, I agree with your post 95%. Thank you for your input, though :D. Here is the other 5%. You said: "I've been trying to sneak in an episode here and there when he is busy; quickly flicking the controller when I hear his footsteps gettting closer !!! What ? Why am I being punished ?
Am I looking at something horrid ? It's a dance contest.

Tonight I watched the complete hour of the semi finals of Dancing with the Stars... and did not change channels whenever I heard his footsteps nearing the room.

I simply stated to him, " I know these outfits and makeup may be a trigger for you, and I admit they have been a trigger for me too ( anger ).... but I am not going to restrict my life and limit the things I enjoy any longer, because you or somebody else can twist what it is...... into something it is not"

I don't think that you are punishing anybody. Not really the way I would look at it. It is a huge pity that the women on Dancing with the Stars feel a need to show off everything they have got in order to win. They seem to think that being a good dancer simply isn't enough. Our society in a nut shell: who cares what a woman can do, it is all about her body parts. I commend you for doing your part and trying to avoid triggers for both of you. Perhaps, though, it doesn't need to be a sneaky thing. Maybe you and your husband should come up with an agreement. You can fastforward through triggers, or leave the room if it is a live show, etc. Try not to take it personally that you have to do this. Getting upset about society will in no way help you and your husband recover. Trust me: been there, done that. I have yelled, screamed, protested what I see every day in the outside world. I can't change it, and neither can you. But you CAN change yourself. Your husband CAN change himself. So concentrate on that. Don't look at it as punishing yourself or punishing him. Look at it as protecting both of you. Maybe have a discussion with your husband. Alot of times when we are avoiding triggers we kind of just avoid the subject all together, which probably mitigates the whole process. It is probably important to discuss the process openly with eachother. Tell him why you need to avoid your anger, upsetting triggers. Let him tell you why he needs to avoid the sexual triggers. Maybe even continue the discussion further. Perhaps get updates from him.?.? Ask him how seeing women dressed that way made him feel. Was it sexually triggering for him? Emotionally triggering for him? Etc. I would presume that as time goes by things will change. He will no longer be sexually triggered, but probably more emotionally triggered, like you. Keeping up a dialogue is an effective way of managing recovery together. Just some thoughts. Thanks for your post! :D

Rich

[Hopeful]

Hi Maggie,

DWTS' has always been one of our favorite programs. I understand your feelings completely. At first I couldn't bring myself to watch it because of how it made me feel and then
I would start watching it when he was at work. I think because we have talked about it so much and him looking away or leaving the room when a few of girls would be so under dressed, we have
been able to enjoy it again. Not that I still don't get those "pangs" every once in awhile when I am watching but he is aware and asks me if I'd rather turn it off and sometimes I do.

As for movies...we are still very selective of what we watch and I really can't see myself watching an R rated movie again...but I also thought I was done with all tv for a while there.

[TooSensitive]

Maggie, great post here! I know for awhile I was triggered by nearly all things, but as I heal myself, the triggers are not always so triggering. There are still certain places that I feel we need to keep "off limits" for now; and there are certain movies, too.

But we have resumed going to a few places that have triggering, or should I say "potentially" triggering waitresses, depending on where each of us is at. And we are also at times watching PG movies, which doesn't mean they don't have triggering characters or scenes.

When I am doing better, the triggers cease to be triggering. Sometimes that takes no work or hardly any work on my part; sometimes, that takes alot of work. Many times, I am successful at avoiding feeling triggered; sometimes, I am not. Sometimes, my h does what he needs to be doing to avoid being triggered, but not consistently. When he's not doing his work, that can create more work for me.

Last night, we did watch a movie which had triggers in it. I was on the fence as far as being triggered, but I could feel myself push toward the right direction of not feeling triggered after all. What helped was that my h did not seem to be triggered. Thinking back, he did leave the room several times during some of the triggering scenes. When he does what he should be doing, I don't have to work so hard within myself. When he takes responsibility for his own behaviors, that lightens the load for me.

I read this thread yesterday, and I used some of what you said to help me through last night. I thought to myself, "Why should I avoid watching this movie, just b/c of my h? I like this movie!". I mentally placed all the responsibility for his own behavior on him; and then, he met my expectations and my needs, in remaining responsible for himself as we watched the movie. And I didn't have to say a word to him in advance to remind him of what he already knows he needs to be doing consistently anyway.

So thank you so much for starting this thread and for sharing your thoughts on this subject. B/c I have already put some of those to good use in my own life!

Next step, and for us, this might be a biggy...start watching DWTS! I am a dancer at heart, so I would love to watch this show, all for the love of the art of the dancing that is done.

[maggie]

Oh thank you all so much for your replies... Makes me stronger knowing that others are experiencing the same problems in their homes and are trying ways to deal with it. INOH... I think you're right that most homes dealing with this p problem have the additional problem of scanning, limiting and screening their long time favorite shows that use to seem innocent and entertaining.

The costumes & wigs...on DWTS.... well they are not so innocent... and quite revealing. In the beginning, I cringed at the low cut tops and padding the women wear... etc...but I'd get so caught up in the dance technique and watching how much some contestants improved.... I'd soon forget about their revealing outfits.

The familiar breeze of innocent air that use to permeate the world around me, where I saw just what I needed to see and just what I was looking for..... and I wasn't turning away from things or having bad thoughts about things that I looked at. Everything out there use to be on a level field.

I'd be waiting in the slowest line at the grocery store, I'd see the new mags and so I grab one with some Hollywood starlet on the cover...thinking ' Oh yea, that's so and so, she was really good in that Walk the Line..Cash movie. What's she doing now? '
I'd skim it for news, the latest movies or scandals in the Hollywood. Then put it back and pay the food bill. Case closed.
Those moments and actions of innocence were just that. Nothing I looked at had any double meaning to me. Nothing I looked at caused bad feelings of anger and hurt and this new dreaded feeling of " Oh no, I hope he doesn't see this "...

Life sure was more simple before all of this surfaced in our home.
Now I still seem to always chose the slowest check out line !! But now I avoid the covers on the magazines, and when they do catch my attention, I look suspiciously at the over photoshopped, overly blonde, overly made up, and under dressed star and think, " You are so pretty and so talented, why do you have to flaunt these photos of youself like this.....Do you want respect, maybe win an Academy Award for you work and talent, or is it more important for you to be made up to resemble a porn performer ?"

So waiting now for the time when those racy covers do not pull me in anymore. Life us to be so simple and level before all of this.

Again, I feel it is important to acknowledge.... if we as SOs are now triggered ( anger and worry ) by these magazine covers...seeing the peddling and arousal aspect of them and we were never looking or enjoying them in the secret thought patterns of objectification of a pa..... Imagine what a challenge this must be for men.

Some stores have a ' Candy Free ' check-out lane. How about a ' Flaunting Star Covers ' free check out lane.

[Beanhead]

I want to throw out some other thoughts into this thread.

Something inside me rejects the idea that seems to be in this thread, which is to say, "he's the one with the problem, he should deal with it! I don't have it so why should I be 'punished'"?

While in theory this is true, in practicality, in would be very difficult to do. Let me use a different addiction to make my point. If a wife has an alcoholic addiction, what would you think of the husband who says, "well, that's her problem, she should deal with it. I still can indulge in my drinking at home however I want to. She just needs to choose to not drink."

Most people would say that the husband is being unreasonable at the very best, or is uncaring and cruel at the very worst. Most would tell the husband that if his wife is an alcoholic, he shouldn't be drinking at home.

Perhaps the best way to handle the situation is what someone already suggested, which is to make a contract/plan where she gets to watch some shows unhindered by his addiction and he gets to go do something in another room that he enjoyes, i.e. playing video games, etc. But the important thing would be to work on this together, making the decision together.

For myself, I would feel a lot of resentment if S&A simply said to me, "I'm watching what I'm watching, this addiction is your problem so you deal with it and I'll do what I want."

Bottom line - if my addiction is causing my spouse to feel like she can't enjoy her life or doing what she's always done (her innocent way of looking at the world has ended), then end the relationship. It sure is better to end the relationship and start again than to feel that resentment inside against the addict. That would help no one and would only cause problems.

Just some thoughts.

[Hibiscus]

I understand the point you're making Beanhead, but that's not how I've interpreted this thread. Maybe I'm wrong, or it's unique to SOs, but I think the point being made is that we become just as triggered, if not more so, than our PAs. I see this thread as more about expressing the grief and frustration that causes. There are things we would still love to enjoy with our PAs, but now we can't. There are things that we used to not even notice when out and about, and now they are huge triggers and the cause of much stress and emotion. It's altered our world...and not by our choice or actions.

I don't watch shows I find triggering with my husband. But that's more about me since he is not triggered by much of what is available on our TV. We don't subscribe to movie channels - we stream movies if there's something we want to see, which gives us more control. But if he came home while I was watching something, and it had content that he found personally triggering, I would expect him to leave the room on his own. I would alert him that there are potential triggers so that he has a head's up about it, but I can't police his recovery the rest of my life. If he wants or needs to avoid something, then he needs to personally assume responsibility for not viewing it. I would not flaunt content, nor would I ask or demand he watch something I know he would have difficulty viewing. But I'm not going to entirely eliminate anything even mildly triggering that I enjoy just in case he might stumble across it.

I've read accounts of women who feel like they can't even use exercise DVDs because of their husband's PA. Some women cut off friendships with their more attractive friends because their PA husband has expressed an attraction to them. I personally have problems being around young women in skimpy bathing suits, so I wouldn't dream of asking my husband to go to the pool with me and I won't be planning a beach vacation anytime soon with him. But what really breaks my heart and frustrates me is that I am now forced to even consider what should be just normal, everyday activities and situations.

As far as leaving instead of harboring resentment, it's just not that simple. My husband and I have been together for 25 years. I love him amd his recovery this past 6+ months has renewed feelings in me that I had started to try to let go of in order to protect myself. We have a child together, a long history, and despite the incredible trials, a lot of good memories as well. We have built a life together. PA is part of that life, but it's not the largest part. I guess it's more about where you draw your personal line in the sand. For me, that line is P, fidelity, and lying. If it returns, I need to walk away from this marriage. But if he continues to be successful in his recovery, then I will continue to strengthen my own recovery so that I can learn to be less triggered as well. While I realize this will always be an issue in our relationship and require care and awareness, my hope is that it eventually ceases to be the primary concern and slips a little further down the daily list of priorities. Only time will tell.

[maggie]

Hey BeanHead,

Thanks for responding to my rant about watching DWTS...and my new found freedom!

You have a valid point. If I was completely aware that my H was an alcoholic and I chose just to ignore his problem and continued to drink in front of him....knowing full well he was craving a drink...that would be cruel-mean-thoughtless. It's selfish..... if it feels good to me....it's tough for him.....This reasoning does sound familiar though.... I didn't do it to hurt you....it's just that I like it and it makes me feel good...

There are a few major differences here.
I wasn't aware of his p problem and as soon as I was Sept 09, I cancelled most of our cable channels and stopped buying popular womens' magazines that might trigger him. I liked those magazines and wanted to look at them, but didn't want to have to hide them from him.

I lost a few cable channels that I really enjoyed. Wasn't able to keep the channels I had before because they somehow included HBO Sopranos and Entourage. I learned that H was using those two shows as his acceptable feeders...both when I was home and when I was out and our teens were around. Not that those shows are terribly bad, but they were able to mask alot of the s*xual peddling contained within them so he could sit there and watch them, as though they were all good ole family shows...

It all added up to me being " triggered ". By that I mean afraid, worried, disturbed that what I had been doing and enjoying carefree and innocently for years, was now suddenly contraband.... in my own home and in my life.

I wanted to support his recovery, so I avoided and eliminated anything that he might find triggering... for a year and a half.

Last week, as I quickly flicked past Dancing with the Stars....again and again... I got rebellious. Why should I have to hide and sneak in my own home just to watch a show about dancing and competition. I put it on and explained that to him. This show was not produced to trigger men, but it does have a lot of showiness about it and if your mind set wants to, it could easily use this use this show to do it.

BeanHead, I was worried that it could start something bad all over again, but it's been over one year of me being extra careful of what I say or do, and I was feeling like a criminal on House Arrest. I wasn't watching Howard S or some purposefully triggering show. It was a general entertainment show.. and NO, I don't like the trashy costumes and wigs that are part of it, but that seems to be the new normal in Hollywood!

I must have sounded heartless, like ' too bad for him ', I'm going to just have my fun. But like any other situation, there is a lot more to it.

Maggie